Seeking Advice for a 25 year old Asian American Guy

Hi Guys,

I'm in a funk recently and have found that my parents, my American friends and my singularly career-minded Asian friends could not relate to what I'm going through; but I'm a feeling that you guys can relate, so I'm here for advice and perspective.

I feel like I'm a teenage with an identity crisis. On one hand, I have a high-paying job at a Fortune 500 company and am confident at it, a decent chunk of savings for a down payment for a house in the major metro I live, plan and get invited to lots of social get-together's with friends and co-workers, have grinded hard at learning how to play the guitar and weightlifting to be good enough to have play and have fun at open-mic's and at the gym benching/squatting/hopping it up. If you met me at the local pick-up basketball game/guitar jam/hacker-space/dinner party, you'll find me as coming across as a self-assured and ground person because like the computer programmer that I'm, I have spent years churning in my head the lines to say to make myself to stand out unlike a typical Asian since middle school to fit in and to be provocative. Everyday was and has continued to be a struggle but I'm proud of what I've accomplished so far.

On the other hand, I'm still deeply insecure about myself and not sure about my personal vision. Recently one of my white female friend crashed over at my place and in one of the late-night conversations came out and said, "I think that you are an attractive Asian man," and all I could do is laugh awkwardly, and even after she said "well, I'm just being honest"; all I could do is be awkward and laugh again. A couple of weeks after that, after I've been friendzoned and she realizes that I'm a pushover, she came over again (she called and said that 'she was having nightmares' and crashed in my living room and the next day, re-arranges my whole apartment, and in the ensuing cleaning, found a stash of cash I had and went out and bought and hanged those tacky decorative plates with Chinese character-signs you can buy at Target/Walmart that say "Peace" and "Harmony" on my apartment wall.

I'm not trying to be funny and I wish that this was joke. It's a f-ing pattern in my life, and I'm posting it not to be funny but so that I can work on my issue. When a female co-worker whom I drove home from a bar confided to me as we got to her doorsteps that "if [she] was ever to shit where you eat, I'd pick you," I froze up because I didn't want to take advantage of the situation because she was mad-drunk and was raving about her insecurities earlier which I could relate to and didn't want her to do something that she might regret later. When a girl whom I'm really into, after a bunch of messaging and dates, suggested that we take a 3 day road trip to Maine and "get a motel and just have fun" - when we were actually on the trip, I was constantly worried if she was actually into me, because if she wasn't - then she'll be stuck with me for the rest of the road trip. A trip of tryst turned instead into her playing a psychotherapist, "so... what are you doing with your life?"

I'm not that dense, I know what my problem is. I'm the nice guy who is afraid to go for what he wants. I understand this intellectually but haven't yet been able to internalize this and am determined to fix this. It's that in critical moments, my Asian values kick in, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" and also a lot of has to do with, ironically my American experience as a minority for being a outsider and pushed around, I empathize with anyone in difficult situations and want to make people feel comfortable/more confident.

But I'm just not a nice guy, I have my own ideas and aspirations. In college, I and my friend started a web-startup that was at its peak was ranked in Alexa top 500 and we made it to the final round of YCombinator VC selection process. One day, I wanted to play the guitar like the White Stripes, so I bought a guitar that day and for the next 3 months, spent 2 hours everyday fingering chords and sticking to a guitar-instruction book until I could finally play "Dead Leaves and the Dirty Ground". Frustrated with my basketball game, I downloaded basketball drills, kept a notebook and worked on moves by myself at the gym until I've perfected them, and then applied them in pick-up games.

But of lately, after 4 years in the work-force, time goes fast and on most days, I feel like I'm going through the motion. Although I still have the external trappings of success of a 25 year old sans a girlfriend, a nice job/apartment/social outings, on the inside I feel like a pool of rotting stagnant swamp-water. And I'm tired of pretending.

On a drive back from dinner with a friend, I was asked "have you ever though 7 years ago, this was what life would be like?" Never wanting to be a downer on the outside, I said "of course not, I thought it'd be much better but we should be proud of our journey so far. Let's not dwell on the past but think about our present and future." But the truth is, I had a vision for what my life could be after graduating college, having real friends (not superficial friends) by meeting people through music jam's/hack-a-thon's/sports rec-league, a girlfriend and my own web startup, not working for the man. But reality has so far deviated from what my vision could be, I feel so frustrated that I don't know how I should spend the last remaining 5 years of my twenties.

I know that I'm lucky in a lot respects and shouldn't be bitching; but sometimes, I wish that I was born in China, never moved here and never have to be exposed to the Asian American experience. But that's crazy talk, I'm also happy and at the same time excited for the challenges, crash n' burn's that I'll face head-on.

I've accepted that in the end, I'm all alone in this world and it's up to me to be honest and face up to my problems; and I have faith at the end of the day, if I leave my heart on the court, then that's all it matters. I realized that this is a long, rambling and narcissistic-sounding post, but I wrote this for myself to sort things out. If you read it this far, thanks for listening and I wish you best of luck and/or feedback you have.

Wow!

You are the first remotely interesting guy to come along this board.

This guys (all you posers out there), is a cool dude in the rough.

Give yourself some time, brutha.

Continue to find out what makes you tick. Continue to do what you love. This will make you a far more interesting person to others...girls and guys. You seem like an interesting person already. You just gotta grow into your shoes a little.

Girls will dig you and guys with similar interests will start to hang with you, thus developing more deeper friendships.

Beautiful women are attracted to confidence that naturally exudes from those who are totally in tune with themselves. It doesn't mean the person is without hang ups, it just means that they know what is lacvking in their life and either strengthen that weakness or strengthen other strong points in their life. Same thing.

As for meeting girls. To quote Scarface: First you get the money, then you get the power, then you get the women.

This is about as true as life gets.

Losers think that by tapping some chick on the shoulder, telling them that they are beautiful and showing them a card trick will get their panties soaking as they rip your pants off to suck your dick. Nope. It might work for the skanky ones. But for real women. Real beautiful women. They want to see what you have to offer them because they have a lot to offer you. And it just isn't money, if everyone is wondering. If you don't know what I am talking about, they y'all (the dipshits) aren't ready to handle a beautiful lady.

I take it that you live in San Fran. From my experience and from my friends that have lived there, it is one of the shittiest places for being single. The majority of the people there are just like you. Young professionals in good careers that have superficial friends due to the transient population.

That's just the demographics of San Fran. It used to be my favorite city to visit and hang but the aggressive vagrants, the mentally ill, the extreme liberal beliefs and practice has made it into America's STD ridden toilet bowl filled with diarrhea (to me).

But it doesn't mean that you won't be happy nor find someone that just makes you go 'yeah, there she is'. Take your time. Enjoy the ride. It sounds like you have a lot to offer. Just make sure the girl has a lot to offer as well.

Cheers.

Read JT's book.

And take pride in the fact that by entering the community, you're empowering yourself to be more.

I accidentally stumbled upon this site while searching for Django tutorials. I'm going to respond since you mentioned "YCombinator" and any fan of Paul Graham is cool in my book.

Let's analyze the situation:

1) Your chick friend who stayed over
'she was having nightmares' and crashed in my living room and the next day, re-arranges my whole apartment, and in the ensuing cleaning, found a stash of cash I had and went out and bought and hanged those tacky decorative plates

WTF are you thinking letting her do that? You are no longer a pushover but have been downgraded to doormat. Never ever let a girl do that to your domain. It is YOUR domain. You've been spunned into what I like to call the "Doormat Game." Being a doormat is equivalent to being the gay best friend. The girl knows that you like her so she "uses" you and plays around with you. It's a power trip. When she has a flat tire...who does she call? You. If her computer is broken, who does she call? You.
You need to break this cycle and say "No." Just say "No." Get out of the game. It's a cruel game girls play.

2) I'm not that dense, I know what my problem is. I'm the nice guy who is afraid to go for what he wants.
There's nothing wrong with being a nice guy. Just don't be a stupid one.


3)I had a vision for what my life could be after graduating college, having real friends (not superficial friends) by meeting people through music jam's/hack-a-thon's/sports rec-league, a girlfriend and my own web startup, not working for the man. But reality has so far deviated from what my vision could be, I feel so frustrated that I don't know how I should spend the last remaining 5 years of my twenties.

Uhm, please watch this video at 19:30 : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELC_e2QBQMk

In San Francisco, you have to be either a gay man or an asian girl to get a date. If you live in San Fran, go look for dates elsewhere like the surrounding areas: Palo Alto, Cupertino etc. You're not going to meet a girl at BarCamp or hackathons, there's hardly any girls there at those events. You said you played basketball? Volunteer to coach a basketball game for church or something..that is if you go to church. Church is a great way to meet people since they always have a lot of events.

The best way to meet a girl is to be introduced to one by your friends. Other options is to use sites like match.com. The quickest way to get a girl is to find a hot girl who is your friend. When your chick friends see a hot girl giving you attention, they will automatically want you. It's competition in the female world.

You shoot hoops which means you are in shape...that's a good start. Change up your dress style and hair style. Confidence is an illusion. Master the illusion and get the girl.

Why should you listen to me: I'm a chick. Joined the board because I find it fascinating...or maybe I'm just procrastinating the stuff I really need to do

Simple advice.... you need to get laid. I'm not even kidding.

Second, take a week or even few weeks off and take a trip to either (Russia/Sweden/Croatia if you like white girls Brazil if you like Latina girls or Tokyo/Seoul/Beijing if you like Asian girls.)

If you've got the resources, I HIGHLY RECOMMEND THIS.

Lastly, I'm a musician myself but also in the business world (yawn). Money can only buy you so much happiness. Really ask yourself what your true passion is and either make more time for that using efficient time management OR try to earn a living doing that.

Now, if you're truly happy doing what you love, then props to you. Seriously, props to you. HOWEVER, IF NOT..

Who gives a fuck if you work for a Fortune 500 company. All companies cook their books, and only care about the bottom line. You're just a number to them. Like are you really helping humanity? Life is too short to be living for somebody else or worse yet, for what you feel the social mirror says is "successful"

As for what your white girl told you? Still not quiet sure about the context. Either she wants to fuck you and gave you signs but you chickened out (which in that case, you deserved to have been friendzoned.. sorry, truth hurts but you need to learn from it) OR she could feel that you have a major chip on your shoulder about being asian. Stephen Covey in his book "seven habits of highly effective ppl" has a great saying "the way you feel inside speaks louder than any words you say". So true. Add to that women's intuition, and you're basically an open book.

Anyways, good luck brother. The last bit of advice I'd give apart from getting a total reboot, is make sure you have enough savings to cover you a year while you figure shit out. It's hard to live life to the fullest when you're broke, haha..

I've thought about this too. I'm actually interviewing for jobs in China, (for a lot of reasons not just to go there to get laid, haha) because I realize how much a reboot would help me out here.



Very true. Something I need to dig very deep and figure this out. Problem is, I have a lot of interests but life is too short to be indecisive.

Thanks for your reply. Appreciate it a lot, really.

I'd totally go there just to get laid....

What other better reason, haha.. Seriously, there are english teachers in Japan who live better lives than rich guys in California. I've known countless near broke english teachers who have multiple girlfriends and also known so many well to do business associates who have nice fancy cars, well stocked IRAs, nearly paid off mortgages but haven't gotten laid in years.

Man Jose
Man Francisco
Los Mangeles

Yeah, I'd go to a country just for that reason...

LOL, thanks for sharing your post brother. I haven't read something entertaining in a while.

Don't be afraid of having sex with girls who are drunk, a lot of girls use alcohol as a way to get rid of their inhibitions and to get over the stigma of having sex with a random or someone for the first time. A lot of woman don't have the courage to do things, woman would rather put the responsibility on the man. If any of their friends confront them, you'll hear the same excuse 'but it just happened'.

And things do go wrong, they go wrong a lot. When you become successful with woman you'll have all sorts of fucked up experiences, having sex with a pretty face & smelly vagina, meeting girls who can't stop stalking you once you hooked up. One time I met this stupidly hot blonde girl who had Asian tattoos all over her arm, after a small conversation she said to me 'In my past life I believe I used to be Asian' I tried not to laugh and I thought to myself 'you are a stupid weirdo' and ejected myself from the set.

Best way to get out of the friends zone is to go 'direct' not sure if you have taken a boot camp but going direct just means upfront about your feelings/attractions to her. You can even go direct by holding her hands and going for a kiss or smooching her up etc.

Oh yes and be the fucking boss, it's your joint. If you don't want a girl there just kick her out for god sake. I used to be like that too easy push over guy, then I had an realization. Everyone's out there looking out for themselves - oh number one. And I should too so fuck it, I relentlessly pursue what I want and fuck off shit that I don't want.

When she said to you, 'you are an attractive asian guy' you should of reciprocated and made a physical move on her. Get her to suck your dick even if you are not attracted to her because you are bored. That's what it means to be boss.

I also agree with everything fucksong written.

Brother Minh,
Australia.

Yo Frisco,

I totally feel for you and your experience. I'm glad you posted on here because to be honest - it's fucking lonely out there.

I'm going to leave the womanly advice to other people because I frankly don't know what the fuck I'm doing in that realm.

But I can tell you what helped me. You need to develop your faith - and not just religiously (I used to be super Christian so if that is your avenue then that is cool and totally suitable for what I'm talking about). In yourself. I mean, you have to realize that you have your own value, and that it isn't determined by these girls or how fake your friends are - or even if the opposite was the case. I think you have great survival mechanism but just remember that who you are is inviolable - noone can take that shit away from you. Sometimes a lot of crap just flies into our lives, but you have to be confident that you'll be the only thing left regardless of what happens - and not only that (because at it's essence that is just survival) - but that you being left is the only thing that matters because you're the only thing that matters.If you believe God gave this life to you, that is totally cool as well.

I agree with what fucksong says but IMO passion distracts you from your true self just as much as anything else. Be aware of your passion - I'm pretty sure you're smart enough to figure out what to do after that.

But either way I think you have to be a rock in the stream.

If you feel like talking about shit with some random dude on the internet, just PM me or post some more.

Take care.

frisco_peaks - Your background and your story is exactly identical to Will, the Better Asian Man. Take a look at his old posts from 2008 or so and you'll see that he went through the exact same thing as you.

He was a consultant in New York, made good money, was in decent shape, bought a house, had everything going for him. Then he decided to move to China and get a job there because he thought it would be the solution to his problems.

Then he took the bootcamp with me after his co-worker said good things about it. Fast forward 4 years, he started getting laid, was able to hook up with white girls finally, realized his worth as a man, kept his asian-american heritage and is proud of it and is now engaged to be married.

Your problem isn't you, it's the fucked up mentality we were all raised with. I grew up in San Francisco, tried to break the mold. But the problem is, I don't have an older brother, and my dad doesn't know shit about how I'm supposed to act and how to date white girls in America so I never learned. TV and Movies didn't help. Advice from girls and books didn't help. Man the fuck up, and stop being a push over with girls. The easiest way is seriously just to take a bootcamp. I wouldn't recommend it if it didn't work. Don't move to fucking China.