PUA is ridiculous

Okay, so I've been looking at some of the works of PUAs for a few days now after my younger cousin told me about it and I've noticed how ridiculous this is. I hope all of you take a step back and think about what exactly you are doing. Paying people to improve your social skills and talk to women? Do you know how pathetic it is to dedicate so much of your time and energy let alone money to learn to act and talk in a certain way just to get laid?

I hate to come off as someone who is bragging, but this is usually inevitable when I'm potentially talking down to people. I am a 19 year old Chinese college student. I attend a HYP ivy league and I'm in my second year here. I have sexual encounters roughly twice per week and sometimes three if the fraternity I'm in throws a party.

I rarely pay attention to my body language, my "approach" or anything PUAs tell you to do. The only bars and clubs I have been to were places rented out by a fraternity. 90% of my social life are on-campus. Most of my time and energy is allocated to my studies, my fraternity, and rowing/working out. I have never approached a girl in my life. Most have either flocked to me during the previously mentioned three activities or during one night stands at parties.

My point is, it's the most beta thing in the world to care so much about what females think of you. All this "I have to approach here in a certain way" or "omg should I use emoticons when I text" takes ridiculous to a whole new level.

If you are in college, go join a fraternity, make some friends and think you're the shit. STOP giving a fuck about what girls think. The thing about confidence is being borderline misogynistic and being an alpha male. Also, since most of you are Asian here I'm assuming, go get yourselves white friends. Start hanging out with them. Focus on YOUR goals in life. Like I said before, I rarely talk to girls seriously during day time let alone approach them, yet I'm the most sexually active Asian male I know.

The one thing that everyone can do is to change their appearance. With that being said, working out is the most direct possibly the top 3 most important things you can do for your social life. Not only will you start looking better, you will be more motivated in doing anything in life. I started out at 5'11 140 lbs and now I'm 5'11 165 lbs with less body fat and more muscle. Your clothing is somewhat important but following the advice of PUAs on fashion is a gamekiller. Just go on J.Crew or RL and follow the models. I dress country clubish but that's because I'm in college.

Focus on yourself. Stop wasting your money and time with PUA "techniques". By not giving a fuck and believing in yourself, confidence and girls will naturally come.

ok, cool, but have you thought about if you moved to a different part of the country for work and have almost no friends there? let alone an asian frat to hang out and party with?

College is one of the easiest places to get laid, especially frats and sororities, with or without skills. Look beyond your own environment before coming to a quick criticism of others.

Joshua,

I think it's awesome that you've figured how to be confident, alpha, dominant, and it sounds like you've also leveraged those characteristics to romantically connect with women.

I understand the core of your advice-- working out, improving one's appearance, "not giving a fuck," "believing in yourself," and "allowing confidence and girls to naturally come." I don't doubt that it worked for you, but what about people, like me, for whom "working out", "improving one's appearance", "not giving a fuck" and "believing in yourself" wasn't good enough? When I started doing these things at age 23, I was 5'8" and 135lbs--- wayyyyyy scrawnier than you. I worked out with a trainer and got up to 169lbs gradually over the course of 3 years, and most of it was muscle (maximum chest press: 225lbs, max. dead lift: 275lbs, max squat 235lbs). I also "didn't give a fuck" and "believed in myself," but the fact of the matter is that I had zero girls "naturally coming to me." Even so, I understand what you're saying here, and I'd probably be saying the same thing if I didn't have to do anything beyond working out, improving my appearance, and "believing in myself" in order to meet girls. But unfortunately, the reality for me was that this was just not enough, and only after I learned the right fundamental skills of how to talk to women did I really begin to leverage the musculature and "belief in myself" in a way that helped me have all the romance I wanted in my life.

Prior to taking the bootcamp, I had an average of 2 dates per YEAR over the course of 30 years of my life. After the bootcamp (and after spending a couple of months relentlessly practicing the lessons and principles I learned in it), I was able to get all the romance I wanted and more, and it became more like 4 or 5 dates per week. Then, when I decided to become exclusive with one girl, I went out into the world, chose one, and I've been with her for about three years now. Your life experience, and my life experience, with regards to dating and romance, are pretty much complete opposites. You have found lots of romance throughout your life without ever having to learn any specific skills pertaining to meeting, talking to, and dating women. I have found lots of romance throughout my life, but only after the point where I was taught how to meet, talk to, and date women.

Will you now tell me that if I had not taken a bootcamp when I did, that "confidence and girls will naturally come", or that they would come to me at some unknown and arbitrary point in the future? I took the bootcamp at the age of 30, and after spending all those years (from the age of 23 to the age of 30) "working out", improving my wardrobe, "not giving a fuck", and "believing in myself." How many more years should I have waited for girls to "naturally come" to me? Maybe you are right, Joshua. Maybe I didn't need do a bootcamp after all. I guess it's too late now, and we'll never really know how long after the age of 30 the girls would have "naturally come" to me. Maybe they might never have "naturally come" to me. Regardless, I am still glad to know that they naturally come to you.

For those other Asian guys who are reading this now who do not have women "naturally coming" to them, you know what worked for Joshua, and you know what worked for me. By the time I turned 30, I didn't want to just wait for girls to "naturally come" to me. I got off my ass and took a bootcamp and learned the skills I never knew intuitively, and I started implementing them and making my life better. What will you do?


-William

I think you missed my point.

1) That's a pretty extreme statement, I'm going to guess either you never went to college. Most GDIs are not sexually active.
2) There is no Asian fraternity at my school, I'm in a predominately white fraternity.

In my own case, that's not something I stay up worrying about. Most of my friends when I graduate are going to be people from my frat/school/work, the people from my social circle. Which everyone should develop from their professional lives instead of trying to hook up with random unemployed club sluts.

Hence, my point is to focus on your professional lives and social mobility which in turn forms your social and sex lives, instead of focusing purely on that, let alone paying "PUAs" to teach you how to hit on random females.

No, I did not miss your main point at all. I merely pointed out a flaw in your baseline assumption upon which your whole argument is based. On the contrary, you are missing my point by recklessly underestimating my educational level. And your second point has no relevance whatsoever to my main argument.

Nevertheless, your ambition is all good and grand, but not realistic or feasible for everyone. Not everyone has the fortune to work at the same area/field where their social circle friends work at. So once again, you have no right to speak of others in entirely different situations in a such a condescending manner.

You lack empathy my friend. Your naiveness just shows it. You have no idea what kind of situation a lot of us were in growing up or why we seek out this community. You grew up in a situation where everything was nicely handed to you and eventually fell into place. Maybe you lived in an wealthy area with a lot of well connected friends which allowed you to be successful, then you got into a good college and landed into a great social circle.

Not all of us are lucky as you. I'm a relatively good looking guy but my life has been one huge sausagefest (live in suburb, engineer) so I never got an endless supply of pussy in my life. And I didn't have a single powerful male role model. I mean my dad is cool but he's a bit of a pus. All my relatives met their SO in college or got set up. Who would we even learn how to date and do this stuff? I didn't know a single person who was good with girls so I had no one to learn from. I had to actively go out in the world and look for that role model. I have to go out o fmy way to go look for beautiful women. What would you do in my situation?

You're a smart guy. Instead of judging us, learn how to walk in our shoes.

Joshua,

I certainly agree with your point that people should focus on their professional lives and social mobility. Those aspects are actually part of the fundamental core principles and lessons that are taught during the bootcamp.

At the root of one's professional life is one's ambition, and one's passions. The cultivation of these aspects of one's life, as well as the cultivation of basic conversational skills needed to convey these aspects to others (in order to advance social mobility), are at the very core of what is taught during the bootcamp, and it remains the core of how I advance myself professionally (and also in terms of social mobility).

At the root of one's "social mobility" is one's ability to communicate with others in a social context. These basic and rudimentary conversational skills are also a key component of the fundamental skills that are taught during the bootcamp, and are what I continue to use to the present day in my life.

I had a bit of a head start, though, because I was extremely advanced in my professional endeavors. At the point in time when I took the bootcamp (30 years old), I reached a point where I was among the top 2% of highest paid contractors in my department (a global financial institution), I live in a nice apartment in the prime real estate section of my city (I bought this one after I sold the previous one, which was in a different neighborhood in this city), and I have leveraged my professional success to set up a series of investments that will finance me well into the future. So the professional aspect of what you're addressing was never a problem for me.

In terms of social mobility, I had a pretty decent sized social circle which contained about 15 girls in it mixed in with some guys, I ran a volunteer organization and led a crew of 8 volunteers to plan, advertise, and execute weekly variety shows at multiple venues, as well as outdoor concerts (3 concerts per year), over the course of the three years that I was in charge. These were enormously complex community functions that required coordination with multiple cultural groups, advertisers, performing artists, as well as local government representatives. So, on the social mobility front, I pretty much had a good handle on interpersonal communication and cooperation with others.

I have always had these two aspects well handled in my life, many years prior to taking the bootcamp. However, the part where you mentioned "focus on your professional lives and social mobility which in turn forms your social and sex lives," didn't seem to quite work for me. It is quite obvious that I was a professional success, and it is quite obvious that I had really good interpersonal skills because it is pretty much impossible to organize, coordinate, and execute large scale complex community events without tight communication skills, and without a solid personal network of contacts.
But despite having these things working really well for me in my life, I never got to the point where they just "in turn formed my social and sex life." I did not experience the same magical influx of girls that you have been able to enjoy simply by your working on your professional life and your social mobility. I went out on very few dates (an average of 2 per YEAR, which equates to 363 days of not going out on a date). I had lots of female friends, but I went on very few dates, and if you do the math, I'm sure you can figure out that I had even less sex.

There is no question in my mind that you have been able to leverage your "professional life and social mobility" and have them "in turn form your social and sex life," but that never "formed" for me. Will you now tell me that I should have "just waited" for my sex life to "form?" Perhaps you are right, Joshua, in that perhaps I actually should have waited for it to "form". However, after reaching the age of 30 and seeing no sex life "form" itself in the way that it did for you, I decided to learn the skills that I really needed to learn, practice them, and actively do something to make my life better. I'm really happy for you that you have had no such need to do that, and I wish you all the best.

And for all of you Asian guys out there reading this-- will you also wait for your sex life to "form?"

-William

Josh, you are in the middle of one the greatest periods in your life and I'm very happy you are enjoying yourself. William has shared a lot above, but if you want to know more, read this thread on the board

newbie-board-beginners-hell-f49/imo-a-true-pua-doesnt-need-to-pick-anyone-up-t6158.html

There is much in common between your views and those of the original poster of the linked thread.

Joshua, it's easy to be incredulous at the misfortune of others when you are in a position of great privilege. Perhaps you would find it more personally rewarding to be grateful for the many uncontrollable circumstances that have helped you in life. Despite the condescension, close-mindedness, and possibly malicious intent to troll behind your words, I appreciate your question for the discussion it has brought up.

Actually, I did the same thing as you in college, I started working out more, lost weight, gained muscle and joined a frat. Didn't help me out at all. Some people get it or they don't. If they don't that's what ABC's is for.